Best way to make 3rd and OD clutches last on a stock truck
08-06-2011, 06:32 AM
#1
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Best way to make 3rd and OD clutches last on a stock truck
2 years ago I had my tranny rebuilt by a reputable builder (he builds tranny's that live in 7 second cars, he built my 200-4R in my mid 10 sec. Buick and I have had no issues period) totally stock no upgrades since my truck is pretty much dead stock (99 5.3L ECSB Z71), and the other day it burned the 3rd and 4th clutches. He fixed it for basically nothing, but now I would like to look into something to hopefully make it last longer this time. It was 2 years, but not a lot of miles. Granted most of the miles were loaded or towing.
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
08-06-2011, 12:53 PM
#4
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Unfortunately all that can be done is to do several upgrades in the input drum itself which will stabilize the entire assembly. The most important change is to use borg warner high energy clutches and set it up tight initially. The factory allows for a clutch pack tolerance of some .060" -.090". Most high end builders do not set up the 3/4 clutches anywhere near that loose. It is common to see the 3/4 clutches set up somewhere in the .020" - .025" range. Some go even tighter!
The other significant change is to go with a sleeved drum and a billet overruning clutch piston which stabilizes the application of all the pistons in the input drum assembly. But, of course that starts getting into a little bit more of a build than a simple stock rebuild.
It sounds as if you have a good relationship with your builder... that counts for everything in my book. The 60e series transmissions will need to be freshened up from time to time whether they are stock builds or rowdy performance pieces... and it sounds like your builder "gets it".
Just keep the maintenance up on it and you'll do fine. If the failure occurs again you might ask you guy to look into some upgrades to make the unit more stable down the road.
Hope that helps....
g
The other significant change is to go with a sleeved drum and a billet overruning clutch piston which stabilizes the application of all the pistons in the input drum assembly. But, of course that starts getting into a little bit more of a build than a simple stock rebuild.
It sounds as if you have a good relationship with your builder... that counts for everything in my book. The 60e series transmissions will need to be freshened up from time to time whether they are stock builds or rowdy performance pieces... and it sounds like your builder "gets it".
Just keep the maintenance up on it and you'll do fine. If the failure occurs again you might ask you guy to look into some upgrades to make the unit more stable down the road.
Hope that helps....
g
Last edited by Gilbert@Ace Racing; 08-06-2011 at 02:09 PM.
08-06-2011, 01:20 PM
#5
I like your answer Gilbert,
Seems like all the pros like the high energy BW clutches, glad they are in mine.
The real reason here is that everyone beats around the bush is that the 60e doesnt belong in a heavy truck, its just plain physics.
Sure they can be built but how long they last for someone who daily drives with lots of power???
80e FTW.
Seems like all the pros like the high energy BW clutches, glad they are in mine.
The real reason here is that everyone beats around the bush is that the 60e doesnt belong in a heavy truck, its just plain physics.
Sure they can be built but how long they last for someone who daily drives with lots of power???
80e FTW.
08-06-2011, 04:26 PM
#6
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No idea
Not going to happen, I'm not abusive on my vehicles but intent to use them to their full potential.
I find this hard to believe (no offense), I mean I bought this truck with about 100k on it, and I put another 80k HARD miles on it (lots of towing, lots of WOT shifts, etc.) and it never missed a beat. Only reason I pulled it was I started getting this mysterious whine in OD. So I pulled it and had it gone through at my convenience. If this thing was a hot rod I would understand, but it just has a drop in K&N and gutted cats that's it. Maybe I was just lucky the with the factory tranny.
On another note looks like I have more problems, I got it finished up today and filled it with fluid, went for a drive and no OD (actually it felt like it was trying to go into OD with 3rd still engaged it would actually bog the motor), and then when I got home I parked on a hill and it rolled in park! Not a good day for me I hope there's something easy I can do at home without pulling the whole damn tranny again.
I have a bit of a hard time with this as well, RPM has 60's that live in 8 second full weight vette's (I've seen their 9 second full weight vette personally) and while I know vettes are lighter we're only talking about somewhere near 1500 pounds (not including super jacked up trucks with gigantic tires). I have to think a built 60 will live in a daily driver type truck (read: a truck with mild mods, not a 6.0L turbo monster someone drives to work, I'm sure a 80 is needed for such a piece.
Not going to happen, I'm not abusive on my vehicles but intent to use them to their full potential.
Unfortunately all that can be done is to do several upgrades in the input drum itself which will stabilize the entire assembly. The most important change is to use borg warner high energy clutches and set it up tight initially. The factory allows for a clutch pack tolerance of some .060" -.090". Most high end builders do not set up the 3/4 clutches anywhere near that loose. It is common to see the 3/4 clutches set up somewhere in the .020" - .025" range. Some go even tighter!
The other significant change is to go with a sleeved drum and a billet overruning clutch piston which stabilizes the application of all the pistons in the input drum assembly. But, of course that starts getting into a little bit more of a build than a simple stock rebuild.
It sounds as if you have a good relationship with your builder... that counts for everything in my book. The 60e series transmissions will need to be freshened up from time to time whether they are stock builds or rowdy performance pieces... and it sounds like your builder "gets it".
Just keep the maintenance up on it and you'll do fine. If the failure occurs again you might ask you guy to look into some upgrades to make the unit more stable down the road.
Hope that helps....
g
The other significant change is to go with a sleeved drum and a billet overruning clutch piston which stabilizes the application of all the pistons in the input drum assembly. But, of course that starts getting into a little bit more of a build than a simple stock rebuild.
It sounds as if you have a good relationship with your builder... that counts for everything in my book. The 60e series transmissions will need to be freshened up from time to time whether they are stock builds or rowdy performance pieces... and it sounds like your builder "gets it".
Just keep the maintenance up on it and you'll do fine. If the failure occurs again you might ask you guy to look into some upgrades to make the unit more stable down the road.
Hope that helps....
g
On another note looks like I have more problems, I got it finished up today and filled it with fluid, went for a drive and no OD (actually it felt like it was trying to go into OD with 3rd still engaged it would actually bog the motor), and then when I got home I parked on a hill and it rolled in park! Not a good day for me I hope there's something easy I can do at home without pulling the whole damn tranny again.
I like your answer Gilbert,
Seems like all the pros like the high energy BW clutches, glad they are in mine.
The real reason here is that everyone beats around the bush is that the 60e doesnt belong in a heavy truck, its just plain physics.
Sure they can be built but how long they last for someone who daily drives with lots of power???
80e FTW.
Seems like all the pros like the high energy BW clutches, glad they are in mine.
The real reason here is that everyone beats around the bush is that the 60e doesnt belong in a heavy truck, its just plain physics.
Sure they can be built but how long they last for someone who daily drives with lots of power???
80e FTW.
08-06-2011, 05:08 PM
#7
I have a bit of a hard time with this as well, RPM has 60's that live in 8 second full weight vette's (I've seen their 9 second full weight vette personally) and while I know vettes are lighter we're only talking about somewhere near 1500 pounds (not including super jacked up trucks with gigantic tires). I have to think a built 60 will live in a daily driver type truck (read: a truck with mild mods, not a 6.0L turbo monster someone drives to work, I'm sure a 80 is needed for such a piece.
Its the weight brother that kills brother!
You see, we are answering from a performance side of things.
If you just want a trans for your daily driver with stockish power then rebuild the 60e you have with good BW clutches and a good shift kit and it should serve you well.
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08-06-2011, 07:56 PM
#8
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I had 2 RPM LVL 6 in my truck and burned 3-4's both of haha.
Its the weight brother that kills brother!
You see, we are answering from a performance side of things.
If you just want a trans for your daily driver with stockish power then rebuild the 60e you have with good BW clutches and a good shift kit and it should serve you well.
Its the weight brother that kills brother!
You see, we are answering from a performance side of things.
If you just want a trans for your daily driver with stockish power then rebuild the 60e you have with good BW clutches and a good shift kit and it should serve you well.
08-06-2011, 08:51 PM
#9
Mechanical shiftkit Like a TransGo HD2 or Superior shift kit.
I like them better that just raising line pressure.
You can start with the shift kit to help make quicker/more positive shifts, and then tweak as needed with the trans tuning tables.
Corvette servo is great and inexpensive ( bout 15 bux).
I hear not so good things about billet ones.
Also swap out your plastic accumulator piston for a metal one.
And get a tru cool trans cooler to help keep those temps way down.
I like them better that just raising line pressure.
You can start with the shift kit to help make quicker/more positive shifts, and then tweak as needed with the trans tuning tables.
Corvette servo is great and inexpensive ( bout 15 bux).
I hear not so good things about billet ones.
Also swap out your plastic accumulator piston for a metal one.
And get a tru cool trans cooler to help keep those temps way down.
