Caltracs-Why buy? Just build!!
02-11-2005, 02:25 PM
#21
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Lone needs a flak vest! Oxidizr: What about guys who fab their own CAIs? If he changed the design some,(of the bars)would he still be liable for legal prosecution?
The work doesn't look like 2-bit fab to me. He's trying to save money. If you carry this thing to the max and want to go crazy-quick you'd have to be Castrol or Schumacher or Kalitta to do it.
The work doesn't look like 2-bit fab to me. He's trying to save money. If you carry this thing to the max and want to go crazy-quick you'd have to be Castrol or Schumacher or Kalitta to do it.
02-11-2005, 07:54 PM
#22
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i wish i could see. i get the red x's and i tried to copy and paste into my browser and nada.
anyway a friend of mine made some for his truck. he explained to me what he did and pointed out the differences from his and caltracs. i too have never seen a set of caltracs up close in person to know how they are all bolted up and all, but he was saying when you load a lowered car/truck onto a trailor the caltracs will catch the trailor faster and more often then his. he said his rise with the tire. he pointed out a lot of other stuff that was different and such and such.
anyway, he has them on a twin turbo s10 that runs low 10's on pump gas. also, he isn't pushing that truck hard by any means.
you can see part of the bar. and yes, it is all wheel drive. Safari van chasis.
anyway a friend of mine made some for his truck. he explained to me what he did and pointed out the differences from his and caltracs. i too have never seen a set of caltracs up close in person to know how they are all bolted up and all, but he was saying when you load a lowered car/truck onto a trailor the caltracs will catch the trailor faster and more often then his. he said his rise with the tire. he pointed out a lot of other stuff that was different and such and such.
anyway, he has them on a twin turbo s10 that runs low 10's on pump gas. also, he isn't pushing that truck hard by any means.
you can see part of the bar. and yes, it is all wheel drive. Safari van chasis.
02-11-2005, 08:16 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by oxidizr
You might want to know a little more about a person before making such unfounded remarks ... Do you really know anyhting about Blown's purchasing history? Anyway why should a person's method of aquiring something make them feel bad? Just becasue there are peopl ein this world who know how to get things cheeper or in barter (read-don't have to waste personal time and rip off other people's designs) doesn't mean they should feel bad. I mean honestly ... you don't see the illegal intellectual infringement you are commiting should you ever publish the design specs you have copied? ... their design is pat. pend.??? SO LETS NOT TALK ABOUT ETHICS OR HOW SOMEONE AQUIRED SOMETHING ... It really doesn't mean anything from you.
CalTrac makes an excellent product and a fair price ... not cheep but fair.
They spent some time and money to develop their product and I can't see how two-bit rip off fabricators like to say they are over priced. Honestly how many hours have you put into just copying their design? I can see at least two iterations of your design from the pics alone. Am I being a little critical? sure... but coming from an engineering background myself and having a complete CNC and fab shop at my disposal still doesn't lend me to rip off other peoples design build them cheeper and say I accomplished something.
Build away .. be proud of being an imitator. If you plan ever to release specs, design information or ever to sell a knock off ... I hope you suffer from all the legal implications due to you. I will forward any and all information leading to the prosecution for illegal distribution of information regarding patent infringment. As a SEMA member and designer myself, it is my duty.
If all you planed to do was test your fabrication skills or to occupy some time then great... please excuse my judgment. Don't publish your copied designs.
Richard
BTW- you need to address some pinion angle issues from your lowering from the pics I can see ... the angle is probably contributing to launch att he detriment of u-joint logevity.
CalTrac makes an excellent product and a fair price ... not cheep but fair.
They spent some time and money to develop their product and I can't see how two-bit rip off fabricators like to say they are over priced. Honestly how many hours have you put into just copying their design? I can see at least two iterations of your design from the pics alone. Am I being a little critical? sure... but coming from an engineering background myself and having a complete CNC and fab shop at my disposal still doesn't lend me to rip off other peoples design build them cheeper and say I accomplished something.
Build away .. be proud of being an imitator. If you plan ever to release specs, design information or ever to sell a knock off ... I hope you suffer from all the legal implications due to you. I will forward any and all information leading to the prosecution for illegal distribution of information regarding patent infringment. As a SEMA member and designer myself, it is my duty.
If all you planed to do was test your fabrication skills or to occupy some time then great... please excuse my judgment. Don't publish your copied designs.
Richard
BTW- you need to address some pinion angle issues from your lowering from the pics I can see ... the angle is probably contributing to launch att he detriment of u-joint logevity.
I think making your own is a great idea, and everyone has the right. Your not taking a set of caltracs and making/selling exact coppies UNDER the same name. So there is no legal issues. Build away my friend, and if you would like to make some extra money alot of guys would like a pair. Including myself.
02-11-2005, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Snake Eater
I think the mods must have sat on pinecones lately. Its getting more and more like DTW by the day.
I think making your own is a great idea, and everyone has the right. Your not taking a set of caltracs and making/selling exact coppies UNDER the same name. So there is no legal issues. Build away my friend, and if you would like to make some extra money alot of guys would like a pair. Including myself.
I think making your own is a great idea, and everyone has the right. Your not taking a set of caltracs and making/selling exact coppies UNDER the same name. So there is no legal issues. Build away my friend, and if you would like to make some extra money alot of guys would like a pair. Including myself.
02-11-2005, 10:29 PM
#25
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Originally Posted by Snake Eater
I think the mods must have sat on pinecones lately. Its getting more and more like DTW by the day.
I think making your own is a great idea, and everyone has the right. Your not taking a set of caltracs and making/selling exact coppies UNDER the same name. So there is no legal issues. Build away my friend, and if you would like to make some extra money alot of guys would like a pair. Including myself.
I think making your own is a great idea, and everyone has the right. Your not taking a set of caltracs and making/selling exact coppies UNDER the same name. So there is no legal issues. Build away my friend, and if you would like to make some extra money alot of guys would like a pair. Including myself.
Oxidizr was speaking about that as a member of SEMA and knowing patent laws. Really, the only problem with this thread is the connection to the opening post to the "brand" Caltrac. Both guys have made good points. The thing is that when you patent something, someone else can't copy it to sell or distribute. You can copy all you want for personal use for the most part, it's the selling and distribution that the patent protects the originators investment and engineering. Some patents do protect against any kind of copying period. And as for a CAI, the same thing applies. Really, all you have to do is to alter some part of the design significantly enough that the difference will distingish the two as different. The patent protects against exact copies, not the idea. You can't patent traction or how to move air.
02-11-2005, 10:50 PM
#26
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Snake Eater is just mad at the mods cause his thread in GTT got locked. I posted in it why. I also posted in the thread where the guy is calling him out why. There is NO reason to have a attitude with any of us for that thread being locked. If you have a problem with the reason I stated take it up with one of the Admins.
02-12-2005, 11:55 AM
#28
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I think I went wrong here when I made any comparsent to caltracs. And I am sorry. If I would have been smarter The title of the thread would have been "HOME MADE TRACTION BARS" and I would have never referanced to the about the above party. I was really excited at the time and just wanted to let people now about want I had done. an d the cost.
I would go back and edit my posts and remove some stuff but what was said was said and its how I feel.
I would go back and edit my posts and remove some stuff but what was said was said and its how I feel.
02-12-2005, 12:05 PM
#29
it's all cool.
there isn't any product sold that i dont at least think about building myslef. most of the time it is easier to just buy it for me, i am kind of lazy.
i really dont see a problem with building and selling something either as long as it isn't a direct copy of a product. traction aiding devices are nothing new.
that being said. i think i will order a set of caltracs just to keep my rear all square back there. i see some serious spring wrap now.
there isn't any product sold that i dont at least think about building myslef. most of the time it is easier to just buy it for me, i am kind of lazy.
i really dont see a problem with building and selling something either as long as it isn't a direct copy of a product. traction aiding devices are nothing new.
that being said. i think i will order a set of caltracs just to keep my rear all square back there. i see some serious spring wrap now.
02-12-2005, 12:45 PM
#30
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There is nothing illegal about reproducing someone's design for yourself (personal use, not generating money)...nothing. Now if someone copied someone else's design to sell or use someone's design in a machine that in turn produces income, that person would be in violation of the patent.
Patents do protect the idea. If lone did try to sell his work (not saying that he wants too) he would be in violation. Most patents don't have hard dimensions listed in them, they are a very basic outline of the product. This helps the company protect there design investment. However, if they did patent their design with hard dimensions, someone could copy it and change a single dimesion to create a new product and legally sell it. (from what I understand)
Jeff
Patents do protect the idea. If lone did try to sell his work (not saying that he wants too) he would be in violation. Most patents don't have hard dimensions listed in them, they are a very basic outline of the product. This helps the company protect there design investment. However, if they did patent their design with hard dimensions, someone could copy it and change a single dimesion to create a new product and legally sell it. (from what I understand)
Jeff