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Looking for some help here, if anyone has any ideas. My gasser truck sounds like a diesel, but not sure how to describe the noise and videos don't quite capture it but I'll add some if it helps.
Setup:
-fresh un-ran (except idling while troubleshooting) gen 3 factory 6.0 with factory gen 4 internals, balanced before assembly with ws6store rebuild kit for bearings (including cam) and gaskets
-ss2 cam bought new as 1840-p cam
-Stock ls7 lifters from frankenstein (2 sets. Swapped set 1 thinking that was the issue)
-7.450 pushrods (after figuring out how to use the checker. Previously had 7.400 installed. See second video)
-PAC 1905 springs
-Stock 317s (got them used, no reason to think they've been modified) with trunnion bushing upgrades
-Ls9 gaskets (previously stock. Changed when I replaced lifters)
-210lb injectors from VS in an nbs intake
-Startup tune done by lsxkilr here in kc metro
7.400 pushrods installed video: (only uploading to reflect why I feel that the noise is not isolated and to show how it sounded with shorter pushrods):
The noise seems to not be isolated to a single bank, let alone cylinder but I'm out of ideas. Confirmed pushrods with a checker, replaced lifters and head gaskets as well. I have solid oil and fuel pressure at idle. Last thing I could think of to check would be exhaust leaks but would they cause this? Maybe knock sensors? They're new too iirc. Engine bay will be cleaned/cleaned up once it runs right/before it goes to finish out the tune. Thanks
I swear people overthink this pushrod stuff. That Elgin is stock base circle... LS7 lifters are stock replacements, you have stock rocker arms and LS9 gaskets are the same 51 thou compressed thickness as most any other LS. So why do you have pushrods that are like 65 to 70 thou longer than stock in there? Did you shim up the rocker trays on the heads for geometry or something? I put a lot of this junk together and mine are quiet because usually stock length works out perfect. I have a sloppy stage 3(Elgin 1841-p) in an LQ4 with 243s on it and it's dead silent valve train wise running just factory LS pushrods... Yes... the oem pushrods... not even hardened aftermarket ones lol.
I wouldn't doubt you have bottomed out every one of those lifters with those pushrods and the noise you hear is metal on metal as you created a zero lash solid lifter setup lol
I swear people overthink this pushrod stuff. That Elgin is stock base circle... LS7 lifters are stock replacements, you have stock rocker arms and LS9 gaskets are the same 51 thou compressed thickness as most any other LS. So why do you have pushrods that are like 65 to 70 thou longer than stock in there? Did you shim up the rocker trays on the heads for geometry or something? I put a lot of this junk together and mine are quiet because usually stock length works out perfect. I have a sloppy stage 3(Elgin 1841-p) in an LQ4 with 243s on it and it's dead silent valve train wise running just factory LS pushrods... Yes... the oem pushrods... not even hardened aftermarket ones lol.
I wouldn't doubt you have bottomed out every one of those lifters with those pushrods and the noise you hear is metal on metal as you created a zero lash solid lifter setup lol
I see you didn't fully read my post. I Currently have 7.45s in it because I used the pushrod length checker and that's what I came up with. Per your response "mine are quiet because usually stock length works out perfect", obviously it's not the case every time which is why almost everyone recommends checking length. I too figured it was all gravy with stock length pushrods based on the combination of parts but it was not. It has quieted down since going to the 7.45s but it still sounds bad.
Edit: Furthermore, if you watch the attached videos, the second one is with 7.400s.
Do you have any help or suggestions to make or did you just come here to talk trash about my "overthinking this pushrod stuff"?
Your pushrods are too long, period. Try going to a stock GM pushrod and go from there. Stop getting your panties in a wad. Think about it like this.... you have nothing changed over stock that would cause you to suddenly need a longer pushrod. If that were the case this thing would have been hammering away when it was all stock. You probably have issues combined with your chinese replacement LS7 lifters that pretty well everyone has.... I don't care what box they came in or who you bought them from. You would be better off with the original lifters the engine came with but adding preload to the point of bottoming the lifter out isn't helping you.
Your pushrods are too long, period. Try going to a stock GM pushrod and go from there. No... I will continue to talk trash and laugh, thanks. You probably have issues combined with your chinese LS7 lifters. You would be better off with the originals the engine came with but adding preload to the point of bottoming the lifter out isn't helping you.
Your pushrods are too long, period. Try going to a stock GM pushrod and go from there. Stop getting your panties in a wad. Think about it like this.... you have nothing changed over stock that would cause you to suddenly need a longer pushrod. If that were the case this thing would have been hammering away when it was all stock. You probably have issues combined with your chinese replacement LS7 lifters that pretty well everyone has.... I don't care what box they came in or who you bought them from. You would be better off with the original lifters the engine came with but adding preload to the point of bottoming the lifter out isn't helping you.
Now we're getting somewhere. The second video in my post is with 7.400 pushrods in it. Are you telling me that's how it should sound? As this was a fresh build, the only thing reused was the block and rotating assembly. Do you think that noise, with the 7.400 pushrods, are the "chinese" lifters? In my months-long search, I've found almost as many people saying there are diff. base circles on this cam as there are not. I purchased it AS the Elgin 1840-P, not one of the multiple vendors selling the SS2. I'm not opposed to it (still) being pushrods, but doing it the "right way" tells me they should be fine.
Now we're getting somewhere. The second video in my post is with 7.400 pushrods in it. Are you telling me that's how it should sound? As this was a fresh build, the only thing reused was the block and rotating assembly. Do you think that noise, with the 7.400 pushrods, are the "chinese" lifters? In my months-long search, I've found almost as many people saying there are diff. base circles on this cam as there are not. I purchased it AS the Elgin 1840-P, not one of the multiple vendors selling the SS2. I'm not opposed to it (still) being pushrods, but doing it the "right way" tells me they should be fine.
Did your elgin cam come in a proper box or a white box?
I'm sure buying it as an Elgin you got a real one but there is so many fakes out there its unreal. Mine all come from Amazon but they come in the real boxes at least. All of these "Sloppy" variants are stock base circle. I finally had a Sloppy 1.5 put in a guys LQ4 recently and it's the same deal as the 2 and the 3 in that regard. If it was a chinese white box version... honestly who knows lol.
The lifters are a huge problem in every makes camp right now so it's not a GM specific issue.
What are you running for valve springs as it's not mentioned? Duals or conical singles? The more spring pressure the more force exerted on that lifter.
If you follow Richard's example I can't really question that unless it's a lifter issue. I usually use solid mock up lifters on setups that are a little more extreme like where I shim the rocker stands or have a lot of milling done. It seems a lot of these lifters bleed off quickly or just won't pump up properly at all. Its widespread enough YouTube channels are commenting on it.
Did your elgin cam come in a proper box or a white box?
I'm sure buying it as an Elgin you got a real one but there is so many fakes out there its unreal. Mine all come from Amazon but they come in the real boxes at least. All of these "Sloppy" variants are stock base circle. I finally had a Sloppy 1.5 put in a guys LQ4 recently and it's the same deal as the 2 and the 3 in that regard. If it was a chinese white box version... honestly who knows lol.
The lifters are a huge problem in every makes camp right now so it's not a GM specific issue.
What are you running for valve springs as it's not mentioned? Duals or conical singles? The more spring pressure the more force exerted on that lifter.
If you follow Richard's example I can't really question that unless it's a lifter issue. I usually use solid mock up lifters on setups that are a little more extreme like where I shim the rocker stands or have a lot of milling done. It seems a lot of these lifters bleed off quickly or just won't pump up properly at all. Its widespread enough YouTube channels are commenting on it.
came in that blue elgin box. I purchased it from Star Performance (one of the main sellers IIRC) here in KC. Springs are PAC 1905. Attached is my receipt when I ordered them from Frankensteinin the event that there's something relevant in it.
I use the cheap "LS7" lifters on a SS2 cam and it sounded exactly like your videos with OEM and aftermarket 7.4 pushrods. The LS7 lifters have a pretty big tolerance on preload so IMO that slightly longer pushrod you went with is still in spec as well as the OEM. I went with aftermarket heads and swapped the cam to a TSP V4 Torquer. This time I went with Morel 6504 lifters that have a very small preload window compared to the LS7 lifters. Measuring I used a 7.525 pushrod because of the PRC heads thicker deck and thicker LS9 gaskets. That sewing machine noise went away and the valvetrain is quiet as a mouse. I'm pretty sure it was those generic Delphi LS7 lifters making the noise.
Here is my LQ9 with the cheapo LS7 lifters & SS2 camshaft sounds like a sewing machine. Ran strong but a little annoying at idle.
The sound on my GoPro kinda goes in & out but you can hear the noise.
09-15-2021, 10:49 AM
need help - noise after rebuild
