New engine is tearing itself apart!!!
01-30-2005, 05:52 PM
#21
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Originally Posted by L-EATER
Since you have the pan off you need to pull the middle main cap and examine the rear thrust surface of the thrust bearing and also the thrust surface on the crank. I had the thrust go out at least 3 times last year, might have been 4 hell I lost count after a certain point ! Every time it happened the crank was ruined. Looked like you used a grinder on it. The second time it happened I was needing a crank quick so I just robbed the one out of my original 5.3 (this was before I put it in my work truck) The 6 liter ate that one up pretty quick too. I was really starting to question my engine skills at that point. I have been building engines over 20 years now and have never ever had a prob like this. In your case you were trusting the builder that everything was right, in mine I KNOW it was right cause I did it. So it is very frustrating I know.
When I decided to use the 5.3 in my work truck I bought a crank off Ebay and put it in with new bearings and it has been over 20000 miles now with no problems. I installed it in the same manner as all the others and the clearance was the same. I really can't explain the thrust problem, I asked for help on here, I called all the "famous" LS1 engine builders, all the torque converter people, lotsa local engine builders etc etc. I got a lot of ideas and I tried all of them with no success. All the LS1 experts said they never heard of this problem which I suspect was BS-I know of at least a couple other people on this site who have had the same issue so I know it is not isolated. I would just like to know why it happens. I am reluctant to build the motor I have in the planning stages because of this.
Anyways, I hope that maybe you just have something simple and can be back on the road shortly. Let us know as soon as you find out.
When I decided to use the 5.3 in my work truck I bought a crank off Ebay and put it in with new bearings and it has been over 20000 miles now with no problems. I installed it in the same manner as all the others and the clearance was the same. I really can't explain the thrust problem, I asked for help on here, I called all the "famous" LS1 engine builders, all the torque converter people, lotsa local engine builders etc etc. I got a lot of ideas and I tried all of them with no success. All the LS1 experts said they never heard of this problem which I suspect was BS-I know of at least a couple other people on this site who have had the same issue so I know it is not isolated. I would just like to know why it happens. I am reluctant to build the motor I have in the planning stages because of this.
Anyways, I hope that maybe you just have something simple and can be back on the road shortly. Let us know as soon as you find out.
01-30-2005, 07:00 PM
#22
The "long" crank is like 1/2" longer-it wouldnt even bolt up if you attempted to use one of those with a 4l60e. Unless you were stupid enuff to go buy some longer bolts so you could draw the tranny to the block. That would definitely wipe the thrust out, but it isn't what my prob was-all my cranks have been shorties. Good suggestion though.
let me know if I can help you out in any way.
01-31-2005, 11:13 AM
#26
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Man I honestly hope everything turns out OK and cheap! I know exactly how your feeling. I just got done(knock on wood) with a really bad strand of bad luck with my motor(s)! Got n20 installed after 6+months of saving and buying parts 2nd time I sprayed it had a motor issue-so I replaced the cam,springs,pushrods and got my updated tune 2 weeks later-10 miles into the new tune I blew the motor(4.8)-within 4 days replaced the 4.8 with a low mileage(9k) 02' LS1 and all was good-I thought!-4 days later I start to get some major lower end knocking and come to find out some small piece of metal got on a couple of my pistons and scarred them up pretty good to the point where the sharp edges of the scars were hitting the heads and damaging them again-got that fixed in about a week and the day after I get my truck back a guy at my job dropped a file cabinet(a large one) into my truck 
-Nothing has happened in two weeks now so I hope its over with(knock on wood)! So in one month when all I had planned was a n20 install I spent well over $6000(including all the n20 parts) and that not including the $1000 my work is paying to get my body work done! I was a complete mess the whole time not knowing who or what to blame. It really sucked but I still knew it was only a truck(yeah I know I love mine too!) and I still had my health,family,etc...! Good luck man it will all work out in the end!
-Nothing has happened in two weeks now so I hope its over with(knock on wood)! So in one month when all I had planned was a n20 install I spent well over $6000(including all the n20 parts) and that not including the $1000 my work is paying to get my body work done! I was a complete mess the whole time not knowing who or what to blame. It really sucked but I still knew it was only a truck(yeah I know I love mine too!) and I still had my health,family,etc...! Good luck man it will all work out in the end!
01-31-2005, 06:24 PM
#27
I found the problem today. Pulled main caps. The entire surface area on the #4 main bearing is showing copper 
If you look at #2 you can actually see thin spots in it where copper is showing through. I think I caught it in time, crank is a little rough but not really bad at all. The engine will come out.
May only need to have crank polished or possibly turned. At least its not a complete rebuild it needs, just bottom end. I hope the builder will stand behind it and do the labor at no charge. I wish I knew what happened. The bearing didnt look like it had spun, but it was going to at any time. The guys at work said it looks like everything was too tight, but the engine was suppose to be set up loose. I was told my mains were at .0030. When the engine comes out I'm going to plastigage the good bearings and see what it shows. It could allways be worse I guess. If it hadnt been for that small piece of copper on my drain plug I would have never cut open the oil filter and would still be driving it today
I will try and remember to take my camera to work tommorow and get some pics.
If you look at #2 you can actually see thin spots in it where copper is showing through. I think I caught it in time, crank is a little rough but not really bad at all. The engine will come out.May only need to have crank polished or possibly turned. At least its not a complete rebuild it needs, just bottom end. I hope the builder will stand behind it and do the labor at no charge. I wish I knew what happened. The bearing didnt look like it had spun, but it was going to at any time. The guys at work said it looks like everything was too tight, but the engine was suppose to be set up loose. I was told my mains were at .0030. When the engine comes out I'm going to plastigage the good bearings and see what it shows. It could allways be worse I guess. If it hadnt been for that small piece of copper on my drain plug I would have never cut open the oil filter and would still be driving it today
I will try and remember to take my camera to work tommorow and get some pics.
01-31-2005, 08:38 PM
#29
Just outta curiosity, did you have any oil pressure issues with this motor? It doesn't take much oil loss for these things to eat themselves up. I ran one for a total of maybe 60 seconds with no oil pressure this was starting and shutting off several times trying to fix a no oil pressure problem (which was caused by a piece of bearing that got in the oil pump and stuck the relief valve) Just a few dry starts and the whole motor was toast.
You need to pay close attention to the cylinder walls when you take it down. I would guess that they are scored from the metal in the oil. I hope not, I honestly hope you have some good luck for a change.
You need to pay close attention to the cylinder walls when you take it down. I would guess that they are scored from the metal in the oil. I hope not, I honestly hope you have some good luck for a change.
01-31-2005, 08:41 PM
#30
Just my two cents but what are all the bushings actally made of? If they are brass or bronze (which is a combination of copper and brass) there are many different alloys of these bearings. Then there are sintered metal bearings which are cheaper to produce but if not properly made will fail allot sooner than machined from solid type bearings. Sintered metal bearing start out as a mixture of metal powder and a binding agent which when put under tons of pressure and heat form the finished or nearly finished product. Get someone to make you some bearings to spec out of a solid blank type material and you should not have the same issue if they are from podered metal bushings. Just make sure its the right spec alloy. The US Navy uses allot of AMPCO Bronze, very tough stuff, for bronze it is extremely hard to machine, gummy tough and wear resistant but maybe not porous enough to hold oil well like other alloys.