swapping 6.0 into a truck with 4.8l and air injection
03-27-2009, 12:31 PM
#11
I'm with xlcooplx on that one.
But from what I know, you are correct that you can swap motors only from newer vehicles and as long as that motor was offered on the same line of vehicle. So both the LQ4 and LQ9 would work since they were offered on newer 1/2 ton GM trucks. However, I would strongly suggest that you get as much documentation as to the vehicle it was removed from and from the seller that you can.
But from what I know, you are correct that you can swap motors only from newer vehicles and as long as that motor was offered on the same line of vehicle. So both the LQ4 and LQ9 would work since they were offered on newer 1/2 ton GM trucks. However, I would strongly suggest that you get as much documentation as to the vehicle it was removed from and from the seller that you can.
03-28-2009, 09:04 PM
#12
First of all Air injection only workes on start up when the engine is cold. They have no way of testing to see if it actually works. The Tail pipe sniffer only test for emmisions under load at 15MPH and 25MPH. As far as the OBD 2 test goes the Smog computer only looks for Faults, like when the check engine light goes on.
Now The EGR on these engines are electronic and They do check those with an electronic testing device while the engine is running to see if it is working properly. If it is working properly The engine Die's. Older style EGR's are vacum opperated. They disconect the vacum hose and put a vacum pump on it to see if it works. It will do the same thing if it's working properly.
Cats must be in the same area. There basically the same but are in slightly different location from year to year. Some have a baby pre cat and then a bigger one later on down stream deppending on year and model....
To legaly do the swap and not Waist your time with the refferee, swap the entire long block over and keep all your Factory emmision Junk in place. If you don't want the air injection Crap. You can turn the Air Injection pump Off with a Tune and they have no way of knowing. But it must be in place legally and appear to be complete when they do the visual portion of the smog inspection... Just keep your mouth shut about it's true Cubic Inch Displacement and you will be fine. The moment you mention it there likely to red Flag you in the system.
If you read the guide lines carefully for engine swaps you must swap the entire drivetrain including correct style transmission and correct style rear end that came from the factory with that style of engine. So you would also need to install a 4L80E and a 14 bolt for the LQ4 option. Unless you had an LQ9 from a GMC Denali or SS Silverado. You could do a 4L65E and a 14 bolt.
Hope this helps!
Now The EGR on these engines are electronic and They do check those with an electronic testing device while the engine is running to see if it is working properly. If it is working properly The engine Die's. Older style EGR's are vacum opperated. They disconect the vacum hose and put a vacum pump on it to see if it works. It will do the same thing if it's working properly.
Cats must be in the same area. There basically the same but are in slightly different location from year to year. Some have a baby pre cat and then a bigger one later on down stream deppending on year and model....
To legaly do the swap and not Waist your time with the refferee, swap the entire long block over and keep all your Factory emmision Junk in place. If you don't want the air injection Crap. You can turn the Air Injection pump Off with a Tune and they have no way of knowing. But it must be in place legally and appear to be complete when they do the visual portion of the smog inspection... Just keep your mouth shut about it's true Cubic Inch Displacement and you will be fine. The moment you mention it there likely to red Flag you in the system.
If you read the guide lines carefully for engine swaps you must swap the entire drivetrain including correct style transmission and correct style rear end that came from the factory with that style of engine. So you would also need to install a 4L80E and a 14 bolt for the LQ4 option. Unless you had an LQ9 from a GMC Denali or SS Silverado. You could do a 4L65E and a 14 bolt.
Hope this helps!
03-29-2009, 12:07 AM
#13
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FastBrick knows his stuff
First of all Air injection only workes on start up when the engine is cold. They have no way of testing to see if it actually works. The Tail pipe sniffer only test for emmisions under load at 15MPH and 25MPH. Depending on what county your vehicle is registered in. Up here in NorCal they have yet to institute load based testing. As far as the OBD 2 test goes the Smog computer only looks for Faults, like when the check engine light goes on.
Now The EGR on these engines are electronic and They do check those with an electronic testing device while the engine is running to see if it is working properly. If it is working properly The engine Die's. Older style EGR's are vacum opperated. They disconect the vacum hose and put a vacum pump on it to see if it works. It will do the same thing if it's working properly.
Cats must be in the same area. There basically the same but are in slightly different location from year to year. Some have a baby pre cat and then a bigger one later on down stream deppending on year and model....
To legaly do the swap and not Waist your time with the refferee, swap the entire long block over and keep all your Factory emmision Junk in place. If you don't want the air injection Crap. You can turn the Air Injection pump Off with a Tune and they have no way of knowing. But it must be in place legally and appear to be complete when they do the visual portion of the smog inspection... Just keep your mouth shut about it's true Cubic Inch Displacement and you will be fine. The moment you mention it there likely to red Flag you in the system.
If you read the guide lines carefully for engine swaps you must swap the entire drivetrain including correct style transmission and correct style rear end that came from the factory with that style of engine. So you would also need to install a 4L80E and a 14 bolt for the LQ4 option. Unless you had an LQ9 from a GMC Denali or SS Silverado. You could do a 4L65E and a 14 bolt.
Hope this helps!
Now The EGR on these engines are electronic and They do check those with an electronic testing device while the engine is running to see if it is working properly. If it is working properly The engine Die's. Older style EGR's are vacum opperated. They disconect the vacum hose and put a vacum pump on it to see if it works. It will do the same thing if it's working properly.
Cats must be in the same area. There basically the same but are in slightly different location from year to year. Some have a baby pre cat and then a bigger one later on down stream deppending on year and model....
To legaly do the swap and not Waist your time with the refferee, swap the entire long block over and keep all your Factory emmision Junk in place. If you don't want the air injection Crap. You can turn the Air Injection pump Off with a Tune and they have no way of knowing. But it must be in place legally and appear to be complete when they do the visual portion of the smog inspection... Just keep your mouth shut about it's true Cubic Inch Displacement and you will be fine. The moment you mention it there likely to red Flag you in the system.
If you read the guide lines carefully for engine swaps you must swap the entire drivetrain including correct style transmission and correct style rear end that came from the factory with that style of engine. So you would also need to install a 4L80E and a 14 bolt for the LQ4 option. Unless you had an LQ9 from a GMC Denali or SS Silverado. You could do a 4L65E and a 14 bolt.
Hope this helps!
I agree with the above. Do a 6.0 Long block or short block with your choice of heads (AFR 205's have a carb E.O. i believe), then get a 2002 ECU and a tune, or upgrade the OS in your 1999 ECU. This should get you through while retaining all the emissions on the 4.8 for VISUAL. 
03-29-2009, 12:58 PM
#14
Yea, 1FastBrick has what seems to be the safest, most trouble free idea. Don't raise any red flags and just make sure it passes the sniffer. If the AIR is on there, they'll have no way to tell that it's non-functional. They'll never know how many cubes you have stuffed under there. I was unaware that they actually tested the EGR during inspection...is this during every state inspections or just one where the "referee" is involved? Seems a little time consuming to me, but I know that Cali is a strict state where emissions are concerned.
03-29-2009, 01:02 PM
#15
I worked as a mechanic for a smog guy for the last year. I also own a 2000 silverado with a 5.3 and air injection. I wanted to remove the air injection but found out that it needs to be there for the visual inspection. I had to replace the stupid Air check valves. and I figured next go around I would remove it rather then spend any more money on such crappy system. 02 and up the revised the programing for it. also some out of state vehicals did not have air injection. my buddies early 2000 3 dr model does not have air injection. he got it from alabama. I Also have a very low milage 6.0 stashed away....
Believe me I asked alot of questions and watched everything that was done very carefully. Legaly there were only a few things I could do to assist with the smog inspection and the smog tech had to be present.
Believe me I asked alot of questions and watched everything that was done very carefully. Legaly there were only a few things I could do to assist with the smog inspection and the smog tech had to be present.
Last edited by 1FastBrick; 03-29-2009 at 01:24 PM.
03-29-2009, 01:22 PM
#16
Yea I saw a Super Charged ford f150 Get red flagged by my boss. The guy claimed it made around 700 HP. No it was not a factory super charged set up. even after he returned it back to stock appearing it was still a gross poluter. He now has to go see a ref and it will have future inspections done at a test only station.... basically that vehical is branded in the system now.
The less they know the better.
They don't know what to look for when it comes to head casting numbers and so on.
as far as emisions go they burn basically the same so the emmisions look the same on paper under load
Yes I looked at the report on a 6.0 1500HD Vs. my truck
The state computer also cannot tell if the ECU has been moddifed.
I also have been told it does not electronically regognize the Vin of the vehical through the ECU but I have no way to confirm That or not. I also dont want to get involved since it's a fellony
Basically what you need to know is that it looks for Faults (Check engine light) and that all of the self readyness test are completed and that they passed. there is usually 5. You are allowed 1 to not be complete. This applys to the electronic OBD 2 test. Currently the state can't electronically test the new CAN protocal vehicals. CAN Protocall is like OBD version 3
The less they know the better.
They don't know what to look for when it comes to head casting numbers and so on.
as far as emisions go they burn basically the same so the emmisions look the same on paper under load
Yes I looked at the report on a 6.0 1500HD Vs. my truck
The state computer also cannot tell if the ECU has been moddifed.
I also have been told it does not electronically regognize the Vin of the vehical through the ECU but I have no way to confirm That or not. I also dont want to get involved since it's a fellony
Basically what you need to know is that it looks for Faults (Check engine light) and that all of the self readyness test are completed and that they passed. there is usually 5. You are allowed 1 to not be complete. This applys to the electronic OBD 2 test. Currently the state can't electronically test the new CAN protocal vehicals. CAN Protocall is like OBD version 3
03-29-2009, 06:16 PM
#17
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Thanks, Fastbrick....you've definitely answered a ton of questions we've been unsure about on this issue. Is there any other options we should consider on the intake side, since the pickup is originally equipped with the cable style throttle? Should we use the original intake off the 4.8 or look for one from a 6.0 of a certain vintage, or is it all the same? (all i know here is that we don't wanna starve her of air if we can help it) These are all details that I have no idea about. I'm not on the up-and-up on all the year ranges of these engines and what they all came equipped with. Also, should we be looking for a 6.0 out of a certain year range, or does it not matter? ForcedTQ, you mentioned using an ECU from a 2002. Is there a particular reason it should be one from a 2002? I apologize for my lack of knowledge when it comes to this stuff, but i figure its better to ask someone that knows now before we go shopping and get the wrong stuff.
My buddy whose truck this is going into had a huge concern that tampering with the air injection system could cause his cats to clog up. He has a friend who had a pickup with air injection who installed some pace setter headers, and in doing so, disconnected the air injection crap, and almost immediately afterward, the pickup ran like garbage and after a couple hundred miles, he clogged the cats up and he had to get towed home from pismo beach back to bakersfield, and then paid big big money to have the truck diagnosed and new cats installed. I'm sure there was probably other issues with this dude's truck, as it seems like many of you have blocked off the air injection **** with no problems. I just have to convince my buddy that we can pull it off without problems.
Thanks for your guys' time and advice.
My buddy whose truck this is going into had a huge concern that tampering with the air injection system could cause his cats to clog up. He has a friend who had a pickup with air injection who installed some pace setter headers, and in doing so, disconnected the air injection crap, and almost immediately afterward, the pickup ran like garbage and after a couple hundred miles, he clogged the cats up and he had to get towed home from pismo beach back to bakersfield, and then paid big big money to have the truck diagnosed and new cats installed. I'm sure there was probably other issues with this dude's truck, as it seems like many of you have blocked off the air injection **** with no problems. I just have to convince my buddy that we can pull it off without problems.
Thanks for your guys' time and advice.
03-29-2009, 07:10 PM
#18
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Keep the cable style throttle body, they are the same size 4.8-6.0 78MM. It will cause less headache than to try and upgrade to DBW. The reasoning for utilizing a 2002 PCM is that year would be connector compatible with your harness and have the added benefit of higher resolution Fuel and spark tables in which to tune. Hence it can be fine tuned alot more than your 99 PCM with less memory. Not that it will be easier, just have smoother tables. You still can use your 99 PCM, just isn't the ideal outcome. I believe you can reprogram the VIN on the 2002 PCM to your trucks VIN if you indeed decide to use it.
03-29-2009, 08:00 PM
#19
The truck Intakes are basically all the same in regards to flow. I believe there are three type's
One With the EGR tube that goes in side just behind the throttle body
One With Out The egr Hole
And I believe one for the electric throtle body Should have no EGR hole also. I believe The Electric Throtle body Has a different bolt pattern but I am not 100% sure
The will all flow the same so Just stick with what you have. I know the Trial Blaser SS AKA TBSS manifold had a 90mm TB but Like mentioned before its just to much of a hassel for smog inspection.
As far as the LS series engine goes Your gonna want a 6.0 from 2001 up
The 99-00 have a longer rear snout on the crank and will not directly bolt up. they will also have Iron heads and be painted or look rusty Might be a clue that something is not right with your swap too...
Extrenally and Deminsionally they are all the same so all the parts will swap. as far as the factory ECU Goes the connectors changedthe actuall conectors in 03 so as mentioned if you want a plug and play swap you will want an ECU from an 02. The tables will all be correct an erleir one will work and can be reprogramed but it will probally be easier to get the one mentioned They can be had for around $100
The reason your other budy ruined his cats is that he went to headers and probally a hand held tune with a generic tune. Its hard to explain but basically The material in the cats breaks down and they plug up...
There is a ton of info on this site alone, about the Mechanical/ Hands on part of the swap.
One With the EGR tube that goes in side just behind the throttle body
One With Out The egr Hole
And I believe one for the electric throtle body Should have no EGR hole also. I believe The Electric Throtle body Has a different bolt pattern but I am not 100% sure
The will all flow the same so Just stick with what you have. I know the Trial Blaser SS AKA TBSS manifold had a 90mm TB but Like mentioned before its just to much of a hassel for smog inspection.
As far as the LS series engine goes Your gonna want a 6.0 from 2001 up
The 99-00 have a longer rear snout on the crank and will not directly bolt up. they will also have Iron heads and be painted or look rusty Might be a clue that something is not right with your swap too...
Extrenally and Deminsionally they are all the same so all the parts will swap. as far as the factory ECU Goes the connectors changedthe actuall conectors in 03 so as mentioned if you want a plug and play swap you will want an ECU from an 02. The tables will all be correct an erleir one will work and can be reprogramed but it will probally be easier to get the one mentioned They can be had for around $100
The reason your other budy ruined his cats is that he went to headers and probally a hand held tune with a generic tune. Its hard to explain but basically The material in the cats breaks down and they plug up...
There is a ton of info on this site alone, about the Mechanical/ Hands on part of the swap.
Last edited by 1FastBrick; 03-29-2009 at 09:55 PM.
03-29-2009, 09:25 PM
#20
Just a little info for those who are interested, my truck is a 99 and doesn't have AIR 
It had EGR but I removed it after installing my 02 PCM, which came from a vehicle that was not EGR equipped. I was sweating bullets when they opened my hood to do the visual, but I got lucky I guess, they just looked around, closed the hood and passed me...whew. I'm due for inspection again next month, but my truck is currently broken down with a wounded trans, so I hope I get lucky again when I finally get it back on the road and go back through inspection.
Another note on the 02 PCM swap, the 99-00 PCM's are prone to false knock that often shows it's ugly face after a cam swap. I had this problem after I installed my cam, I would get 7.9* of KR every time I tipped the throttle in...the 02 PCM cured that problem.
It had EGR but I removed it after installing my 02 PCM, which came from a vehicle that was not EGR equipped. I was sweating bullets when they opened my hood to do the visual, but I got lucky I guess, they just looked around, closed the hood and passed me...whew. I'm due for inspection again next month, but my truck is currently broken down with a wounded trans, so I hope I get lucky again when I finally get it back on the road and go back through inspection.Another note on the 02 PCM swap, the 99-00 PCM's are prone to false knock that often shows it's ugly face after a cam swap. I had this problem after I installed my cam, I would get 7.9* of KR every time I tipped the throttle in...the 02 PCM cured that problem.