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How would these work for a baby cam?

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Old 08-07-2011, 01:32 PM
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Default How would these work for a baby cam?

So I'm bored today. I've read in certain places that single pattern cams tend to make more torque than split pattern cams. We all know how well the TR and TSP 220 and 224 work so I was thinking a small single pattern cam might be something cool.

Maybe something like : (Isky lobes)

212/212 .561/.561 on 113 +3

or

215/215 .566/.566 on 113 +3

theoretically they should be kinda like a comp low lift 212/218 but with more torque and a tad more chop? maybe

curious what you guys think?
Old 08-07-2011, 03:38 PM
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i had very good results with my comp 212/218 lowlift
Theres a couple people with isky cams maybe they will chime in
Old 08-09-2011, 12:52 AM
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75 views and one post?
Old 08-09-2011, 06:25 PM
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Have you been reading some comments by Ed Iskendarian?

Originally Posted by Ed Isky
Longer Exhaust Duration: Is this really necessary?

Most stock camshafts from American production V8, V6 and 4 cylinder engines manufactured today are ground with the longer exhaust lobe duration. Or, another way of looking at this is that they are ground with shorter intake durations! The former embraces the viewpoint that either the Exhaust Ports or Exhaust Pipe system is somewhat restrictive, and is in need of an assist. The latter suggests that the intake system is rather efficient and cam timing can be trimmed back a bit with out much sacrifice in power, in order to maximize throttle response and cruising efficiency.

Take your pick here. There is no absolutely correct viewpoint - because both are probably true! In a stock engine running at conservative RPM levels, for the sake of overall efficiency, fuel economy and a quiet smooth running engine, this staggering of intake and exhaust duration is quite common and appropriate.

However, High Performance is another thing entirely. Change one factor, let's say in this case, the exhaust system (installing headers and larger pipes) and you have just negated in most cases, the need for that longer exhaust lobe. Now couple this change with a different intake system and camshaft and you have really scrambled the equation. But, wait just a moment. Why is it that so many people (racers & cam grinders alike) insist on running a cam with longer exhaust duration regardless of what equipment is employed? The answer is "habit". Most of them have been somewhat successful in doing it their way and will probably never change unless virtually forced by circumstances to do so.

Before we go any further however let's review what it actually is we are trying to do with an engine when we attempt to make more power. Our best result comes when we are cognizant of the fact that an engine is basically an air pump. We pump it in and out (although in a different form) and we have problems when one side or the other is restricted. Balance or the equilibrium or flow should be our objective, unless of course we are not trying to make more horsepower!

Example #1 (Oval track racing) Here, I have often observed that the most experienced drivers are those who are most likely to run a single pattern (equal on intake and exhaust duration) cam. Why? Because such cams always, I repeat always make more torque! These veterans have a more educated foot and greater experience in feathering the throttle in the corners. They can therefore, utilize the benefit of added torque, in the lower to mid RPM range, to their advantage.

Their counterparts, the younger drivers on the circuit, generally are not as experienced and may at times actually get "crossed up" in the corners especially with a lighter car or when they are learning the ropes. In their case, a longer exhaust duration is often the more appropriate choice. It will often help them to drive better, more "flat footed" if you will, without consequence. But please for the sake of accuracy, let us be truthful. The benefit comes from an actual bleeding off of low to mid range torque, which is always what happens when Exh. Duration is lengthened, not from any improvement. The improvement, (if any) would come because of an improvement in scavenging at the extreme upper end of the power curve and would usually be marginal at best. Yet the so-called "extra power" potential of a longer Exh. Duration cam is most often why they are touted - power most people are backing away from at the end of the strait away!

Example #2 (Drag Racing) At the drag strip it's a little different and I feel more honest. Here, racers have long enjoyed longer exhaust and longer durations across the board (If I may add specifically for the purpose of "killing" low-end torque) to keep the tires from too easily breaking lose. This has been successful and sometimes actually results in a slight increase in top end power - something you can actually use in drag racing since it is a full throttle endeavor through the lights. Keep in mind here though, it's quite possible that a longer duration cam overall would have done just as well or better. In other words if you needed that longer exhaust for top end, perhaps the intake could have benefited from such a lengthening as well.

One of my favorite expressions is how "The Drag Racing mentality has infiltrated the ranks of Oval Track". Many have crossed over and made the switch in the past 10-15 years and some have brought their preconceived notions about how to cam an engine with them. A few may actually read these concepts and if they do so will at least come away with a better understanding of what they are doing. On the other hand they also could find that this information might actually help their cars to run just a bit faster!

Note: Readers may find Camfather Ed Iskenderian's Top Tuners Tip #33 "Can an Exhaust System Over-Scavenge the Combustion Chambers" to be a relevant precursor.
Old 08-09-2011, 06:40 PM
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Makes me happy the cam in my 402 is a single pattern
Old 08-09-2011, 06:42 PM
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I enjoy my isky 215/215 111 quite a bit, overall extremely happy with it. Think i will go drive it right now..
Old 08-09-2011, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by budhayes3
Have you been reading some comments by Ed Iskendarian?
I think that is exactly what I remember reading.
Old 08-09-2011, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by offroadrider12
I think that is exactly what I remember reading.
Well it's a good read for sure...now you have me thinking about my own setup, and if my smaller 2.5" collectors are enough of a restriction to warrant the extra exhaust duration or not
Old 08-09-2011, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by budhayes3
Well it's a good read for sure...now you have me thinking about my own setup, and if my smaller 2.5" collectors are enough of a restriction to warrant the extra exhaust duration or not
I like making people think.

I would think 2.5" collectors would be better for a mild 5.3 to help keep the low end torque? Most people don't run 3" true duals they run 2.5". IIRC a 3" single is good to about 450-500hp? I would think 3" collectors would just cause a loss of exhaust velocity but I could be wrong.

I was thinking 113LSA would be a nice medium between the common 112 and 114 but IDK. This thread is merely me thinking out loud because I'm bored and can't do anything with a broken collar bone.

Last edited by offroadrider12; 08-09-2011 at 08:38 PM.
Old 08-11-2011, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by budhayes3
Have you been reading some comments by Ed Iskendarian?
So I went to Isky's website, the cams in the LS catalog are all split pattern...


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