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finding payload an tow capacity for my new pleasureway RV van
finding payload an tow capacity for my new pleasureway RV van which is much heavier than the cargo it was built from.
2004 Chevrolet Express Cargo 3500 - Specs & Features
Towing & Hauling
Max Towing Capacity 10,000 lbs.
Max Payload Capacity 4,130 lbs.
definitions:
Curb Weight How much a vehicle weighs without passengers or cargo.
GVWR Stands for Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, and its the maximum weight that a vehicle can reach including passengers, cargo, gasoline, fluids.
Payload How much weight in cargo and/or passengers a vehicle can carry. You subtract GVWR Curb Weight = Payload.
Cargo van Curb weight 5,470 lbs. (I think cargos are heaveir than this #)
Pleasureway curb weight is 8,050LBs I weighted at a large scale
Gross weight of cargo van is 9,600 lbs.
So payload is 1,550LBs minus weight of drivers 200LBs so payload is only 1,350LBs
cargo curb weight 5,470 pleasureway curb weight 8,050 so I subtract 2,530 from 10,000 =7,470LB
of tow capacity
my Pleasureway owners manuel lacks any capacitys. I have read on the net that a van this size will tow 3500LBs.
In conclusion I think my calculations of payload are reasonable however my tow capacity seams exaggerated by twice real world.plus I tow in a hilly area hills like 260' in elevation from 50' above sea level (200 mile trip one way) so decently steep hills not mountains but steep.RV on it's own definitely down shifts to 3rd on majority of these hills.
I have a 03 gmc savana 1500 I mite be better off using to tow though these hills, then use RV to tow for the flat roads on short 5 mile trips.
so are my calculations close to reality?
I'd like to haul a occasional heavey payload. bc of hills mite have to add some torque still deciding what route.
thanks for advice
How heavy is a "heavy" payload for you? 1350lb is a lot of stuff and ppl already
the truck shifting is fine. That's what it's meant to do. Don't be afraid to floor it and let the motor use rpm to do work. Game your hills by gaining momentum down one to carry you up the next one, and accelerate into the hill while on flat
towing is not "set cruise and forget it", it takes some input as the driver to keep things at a steady pace
your altitude is a joke. I'm at 5500' and I can tow fine up here
7500# is also a lot of capacity. That's more than most dual axle, 5 lug trailers are rated for anyway
How did you get the 2530 lb number? Your trailer weighs 8050 lb dry? How much does it weigh with stuff in it?
You need to weigh your van as you would use it. Gas, water, driver, etc. 5470 is not the weight of your van, is it? Maybe a passenger van, but your van as equipped should be heavier.
Typically on these vans (cargo and passenger models), you have plenty of payload. What controls the towing capacity is the gross combined weight rating (GCWR.) In your case, that may/may not be the case.
As I mentioned in your other thread, 3.73 are not best for towing.
From the owners manual:
3.73 GCWR = 14,000 lbs
4.10 GCWR = 16,000 lbs
How heavy is a "heavy" payload for you? 1350lb is a lot of stuff and ppl already
the truck shifting is fine. That's what it's meant to do. Don't be afraid to floor it and let the motor use rpm to do work. Game your hills by gaining momentum down one to carry you up the next one, and accelerate into the hill yeah I've been doing that when I'm approaching the hill I speed up w/ throttle and hold the throttle above the cruise control speed this doesn't allow the down shift.
while on flat
towing is not "set cruise and forget it", it takes some input as the driver to keep things at a steady pace preveious TV where express 1500 an a V8 trailblazor both even w/ smaller engines but half the curb weight where very strong going up these hills never a down shift well maybe a few times the RV is a heavey pig.
your altitude is a joke. I'm at 5500' and I can tow fine up here
7500# is also a lot of capacity. That's more than most dual axle, 5 lug trailers are rated for anywayyes you correct I think my calculations are way off on this tow capacity
I've made my 3rd trip on this route haven't towed the vessel yet. still feel uncomfortable about towing my vessel.it's right around 3500LB that includes trailer and gear.I need to weight the vessel bc I could be off by upto 800LBs on the heavey side.
yes I've been speeding up when approaching hills as wrote above however this route is a county road two lane blacktop, never know when a farmer is entering road so I have to limit the top speed. road is not only hilly but curvy w/ limited sight distance.I usalley never take this route at night.
I was discussing towing w/ a expert he said don't be scared to press the tow button while driving like it's OK to be driving approch hill then engage tow. I thought the button is only pressed before driving and is always left on basically leaving the trans. in 3rd all the time.
so how do my calculations sound I think the payload is about right. was planning on hauling a bunch of pavers so I can extend the driveway so hauling heavey is seldom.
Originally Posted by strutaeng
How did you get the 2530 lb number?woopies should be 2580LB which is the weight differnce of a cargo compared to the RV so I subtracted this as payload weight lets round off to 2600LB
cargo van curb weight 5,470 pleasureway RV curb weight 8,050 so I subtract 2,530 from (10,000 cargo tow capacity) =7,470LB
of tow capacity
Your trailer weighs 8050 lb dry? the RV weights 8050LBs w/ just 1/4 tank of fuel an no fresh water or gear, (thats how I weighted it. w/ full fuel/water luggage gear she weights 9KLBs) How much does it weigh with stuff in it?
You need to weigh your van as you would use it. Gas, water, driver, etc (I can calculate the fuel , water at 7LB per gallon an luggage lets just say full loaded is 9KLBs . 5470 is not the weight of your van, is it?no 5470LB is what edmunds website says a cargo weights an thats a 135" wheelbase mine is a 155" WB Maybe a passenger van, but your van as equipped should be heavier.yes much heavier
Typically on these vans (cargo and passenger models), you have plenty of payload. What controls the towing capacity is the gross combined weight rating (GCWR.) In your case, that may/may not be the case. yes that's what I did I subtracted the extra 2600LBs the differnce in weight from cargo to RV as payload basicely all the RV stuff then subtracted from the max tow capacity of the cargos 10KLBs
As I mentioned in your other thread, 3.73 are not best for towing.
From the owners manual:
3.73 GCWR = 14,000 lbs
4.10 GCWR = 16,000 lbs
I hope this helps.
yes it helps. I understand the gear ratios if I wasn't cruising on 200-300 mile trips one way I would concided a gear swap right not not worth it.
see the problem is these RV ppl don't publish tow capacity #s. now the very simiairl RV the roadtreks same chevy3500 w/ LQ4 they claim a 5KLB tow capacity this w/ a 3.73 gear. remember the thread on which rear end I have.
the y-tuber had a roadtrek w/ a super70 full floating rear end.
I haven't asked this tow capacity ? on my B-class RV forums yet. but have read a little an the consenses is a (9KLB chevy3500 w/ LQ4 /4L80 easily tows 3500. I'm assuming this is a very conservative estimate.
now I have sean the larger C-class RVs towing even more than my 3500LB vessel like midsized SUVs.
I will plan a few test tows to the local lake we have hills so this will enlighten me before I start adding torque. thanks for advice.
I honestly think you are fine. The biggest issue imo is stopping a load. If you have trailer brakes, I'd say you're golden
she's 6.0 LS. Let that girl eat and do work in the upper RPMs. I tow with a cammed, tuned and full bolt on 5.3, makes almost 6.0 power and trust me- RPM is the name of the game. If she wants a downshift, let her have it. Lugging a motor doesn't save fuel and it's harder on everything internal to the motor
I do not use tow/haul but tow/haul will let the trans hold onto gear longer and will command downshifts sooner. It certainly helps!
Dont fear RPM. Let it downshift. It's a stock tune, WOT is fine. If you have to mat it, mat it and party
Ouch! 9,000 lb weight of the RV van, but closer to 10,000lb fully loaded? Then you very close to reaching the GVWR. Isn't it 9600 lbs? That's what the passenger and cargo van are. That won't leave much for trailer pin weight then.
I'm still confused as to what your trailer (not van) weighs. 3500 lb? If the trailer is hauling pavers to your home (as in, not camping or traveling), then you can remove or omit as much weight on the van as possible so you stay within the GVWR.
The reason why they don't publish towing capacities on vehicles like yours is because each RV outfit with add different options and weight of outfitted vehicle will vary a lot, so will towing. The manufacturer can't possibly know this, so they don't publish those numbers. Cab and chassis trucks are the same way. Aftermarket companies will convert them to ambulance, fire truck, RV, wrecker, etc.
Yeah, those larger RVs have a higher GVWR. 16,000lb? I've seen them on the highway towing even cars. They are built on a different chassis platform, but with same LQ4/4L80e. I assume rear gearing is pretty steep.
You still have a 1 ton chassis on that rig, even if it's really heavy itself I would think you should be fine to tow that 3500 lb or 4000 lb whichever. Better make sure your hitch receiver is a decent one, they might have put a low capacity one on it.
It's just a lot of weight so don't be afraid to be running at 3-4k RPM up hills, the 6.0L will do just fine, it's made to work. Just make sure you keep the vitals cool, engine coolant and transmission fluids.
well... since smokinlmm bumped something that seems to've never been answered:
my thoughts are that it's still a 3500 chassis - which in the pickup world, a crew cab with a utility box full of tools easily weighs 9k in its daily configuration and still tows. shoot, my 2500 without much in it is 8000lb according to our local dump. pulling a 3500lb boat is nothing for your van - even with 3.73s. you've got the frame, brakes, & suspension for it to go along with the same powertrain as the HD pickups.
as mentioned above, though: mind your tongue weight (particularly when loading small, heavy stuff like pavers). you want to distribute it so that 10% of the trailer's weight is on the tongue (which counts as payload toward the van) so that it pulls in a stable manner. if you make the tongue too light, the trailer will wag across the road... which is no-bueno!
your gross weight calculations/explanations were honestly hard to follow, but here's how i'd try to simplify things:
- GVWR = the maximum allowable weight that can be measured by putting the van's tires on a scale. the sum of your curb weight & payload (which includes any trailer tongue weight) should not exceed this, and it should be noted on a sticker in the driver's door jamb. it may be different than standard vans because most RV manufacturers are allowed to change/recertify gross weight ratings for the vehicles they modify.
- GCWR = the maximum allowable weight of the van itself + any trailer it's pulling. GCWR minus the van's GVWR is a conservative start in finding you towing capacity, and the only way the van's payload matters here is to account for the tongue weight before loading all your gear so you don't bust GVW. your trailer also has a GVW, and its separate payload is found by subtracting its empty weight.
practical examples using grain-of-salt truecar.com numbers for a 2004 155" upfitter 3500 Express van (your sticker & ratings may vary):
- curb weight (before upfitting) = 5524lb
- GVWR = 9600lb
- GCWR = 14000lb
this means as long as your van weighs less than 9600lb and (your van + trailer) weighs less than 14000lb, you should be fine because they build lots of margin into the safety ratings. you said your curb is 8050, as modified; that lets you fill your van with up to 1550lb of stuff (water, propane, luggage, food, etc). you want to pull a 4400lb trailer? go right ahead (9600+4400=14000)... just plan for ~440lb of that to be on the van (leaves you ~1100lb for stuff inside the van). make sense?
if you load up your van with all the things you need & want to know how much you can tow from there:
- weigh the loaded van (this example says 9300lb with all your junk & fluids).
- that leaves up to 300lb of tongue weight... meaning a 3000lb trailer. if the trailer weighs 1200lb empty, you can put 1800lb of stuff on the trailer.
- on the other side of the fence: if you pack light & the van only weighs 8500lb, that allows 1100lb of tongue weight before busting GVW (indicative of an 11000lb trailer)... which is where the add'l max trailer rating of 10000lb (from truecar) and gross combined rating come into play. also consider: if you've got a Class 3 hitch, it's only good for 8000lb tops. even further: your GCWR stops you at 5500lb (14000-8500).
hopefully those help you do the math for whatever official specs you figured out.
06-16-2023, 12:11 PM
finding payload an tow capacity for my new pleasureway RV van
